tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post5072775343082136568..comments2024-02-27T11:15:46.473-06:00Comments on Quidnon: Coppered Bottom is a No-BrainerDmitry Orlovhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-81077052680180620972019-07-13T12:25:56.514-06:002019-07-13T12:25:56.514-06:00Where are you getting your prices for copper?
At ...Where are you getting your prices for copper? <br />At onlinemetals.com, their cost for a 3x10 ft sheet (cheapest per sq/ft) in .0625 (1/16th) is $962, or $32/Sq.Ft. That puts the sheathing for 784 Sq.Ft. at $25,088, or ten times higher than your listing. <br />Even their thinnest listing (.0162 or 24 gauge) would still be about $7,200.Steve Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02927543988218053738noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-21940720595697114902018-11-02T15:07:22.128-06:002018-11-02T15:07:22.128-06:00You might want to give this a try:
https://www.na...You might want to give this a try:<br /><br />https://www.nanopool.eu/en/metal-coating/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-86668904339772595482018-10-31T16:08:15.631-06:002018-10-31T16:08:15.631-06:00Concerning the mattresses in the berths. Are they...Concerning the mattresses in the berths. Are they a standard size, such as a "full", or will they have to be custom made?MoonShadowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07026735575577934205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-54976636714435117892018-10-09T12:43:56.171-06:002018-10-09T12:43:56.171-06:00Dimitry,
Partway through an 8-year Pacific circumn...Dimitry,<br />Partway through an 8-year Pacific circumnavigation aboard my 31-foot, backyard-built trimaran, Celerity, I tired of beach bottom jobs and coppered the keel using small boatnails and Sikaflex adhesive caulk. Saved a fortune and never painted below the hull again. -RWTWill Thomashttp://willthomasonline.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-86490010517218258372018-10-09T08:08:35.022-06:002018-10-09T08:08:35.022-06:00Orlov have you thought of another copper-option th...Orlov have you thought of another copper-option that I consider for my motor-boat, it is mixing copper-dust with permeable epoxy-resin (floor-epoxy) and simply paint it on the boat-bottom. It is said to have the same properties as copper-plate or even better because of larger copper surface area.<br />"CopperCoat" is i commercialized variant of this but it is very expensive, I recon you can make it much cheaper by yourself.<br />Markus Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11769985185180716136noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-37661377309521550872018-10-09T05:00:18.098-06:002018-10-09T05:00:18.098-06:00That's a different Dmitry Orlov. I am not a po...That's a different Dmitry Orlov. I am not a political analyst, or a hockey player, or a bank president, or an actor...Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-61573408521145215622018-10-08T22:54:57.844-06:002018-10-08T22:54:57.844-06:00I realise this is "off topic" Dmitry, an...I realise this is "off topic" Dmitry, and sorry for that, but I just couldn't resist wondering if you are aware you are now a source of valuable insight to the appalling piece of gutter - rag, the UK's Daily Mail?? <br />I quote "Putin's personal style of rule means he 'cannot hand over responsibility to someone else' for unpopular decisions, political analyst Dmitry Orlov told Vedomosti."<br />This in an article claiming htat Putin's trust level is at only 39% in Russia, "https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6253325/Trust-Putin-fallen-39-cent-Russians-lowest-rating-2014.html"<br /><br />I had no idea you'd risen so high :-) !! <br />Isabellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04272269692464954014noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-72275326254581595862018-10-08T10:52:50.806-06:002018-10-08T10:52:50.806-06:00There are some basic steps to the process. The fir...There are some basic steps to the process. The first step is to have a design. The second is to build a hull, float it and sail it around. The third is to sell some plans and have others build them. And then we'll see.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-15697440991753068492018-10-08T03:00:43.336-06:002018-10-08T03:00:43.336-06:00Maybe I phrased it badly.
The objetive of the pr...Maybe I phrased it badly. <br /><br />The objetive of the project and the bulk of the work that you're putting on has the aim of generating a boat for you, and then maybe sell plans if there is interest, <br /><br />Or is it more framed like a business in the long term? trying to extract profit from all the work that you and your team has done? Jordi C. https://www.blogger.com/profile/05629146174761626383noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-46143163675463607342018-10-07T22:59:19.499-06:002018-10-07T22:59:19.499-06:00There are a few inefficiencies in the US "eco...There are a few inefficiencies in the US "economy" and one of those is, a few things that are thought of as reserved for the rich, are not really all that expensive. <br /><br />On NPR last night there was a thing on a show called "Freakonomics" where they explained that if you get your kid into fencing, you know, with swords, it make it almost a shoo-in that your kid will go to a top ten college. Yes, they have to be pretty good academically, and pretty good at fencing (I've messed around a bit with it and if you practice and spar regularly you'll be fine) they almost "have" to take your kid. <br /><br />And fencing is cheap as sports go. <br /><br />But back to the boat thing ... it takes a fair amount of discipline to live on a boat, but if you can pass yourself off as a wealthy person who has loftier goals than doing something so gauche as spending much money, you can get by just fine. <br /><br />And yes, a better solution still would be to get the hell out of the US. alex carterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12458022111793552536noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-22015586098032318082018-10-07T19:13:04.476-06:002018-10-07T19:13:04.476-06:00Quidnon keeps getting better and better. Thanks fo...Quidnon keeps getting better and better. Thanks for doing the nuts-n-bolts $$$ expose of buying copper plate and its thickness. There is some copper plate sheathing documentation online but nice to have the research done already... and why it makes sense. Anyone who thinks they can just go over the side whenever their painted boat bottom starts to get slimy and scrub it is a buffoon.... it's damn hard work, even with a scuba tank on. And to do it all the time is ridiculous. As for a marketing blitz I'd imagine the more Quidnons that get built and with alluring user pix popping up all over the web it will just snowball. After personally owning and living aboard both a (flat bottomed) sharpie and a keeler I'd NEVER go back to a keeler unless I had to. Flat bottom, shoal draft ROCKS!!!! So much nicer to sail and use. One miserable grounding in a keeler will prove that out plus all the cool anchoring spots keelers will NEVER access. And after living on 2 junk rigged boats junk rig ROCKS TOO!!! A few nights offshore shortening sail in near blackness out on a pitching deck, fighting a flogging sail, will prove this out also. Plus so easy to build the junk rig yourself. And on and on.... but Quidnon hits the sweet spots in many ways. A no-brainer for that poor kid living in his parents basement, feeling trapped, or anyone who resents the crap out of debt and wage slavery.Robertohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18320063715736110902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-60627890014638020712018-10-07T10:41:37.313-06:002018-10-07T10:41:37.313-06:00Actually, it's a good project for anyone who w...Actually, it's a good project for anyone who wants to live comfortably aboard a boat for not much money and have the option to move. The lack of a marketing strategy (you are right, there isn't one) is not a problem. The biggest problem is this: Quidnon is a good solution to the problem of rent/mortage expense in the US, but there is an even better solution to this problem: leave the country.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-74903719313717561322018-10-07T10:38:17.923-06:002018-10-07T10:38:17.923-06:00The copper develops some surface oxidation and pit...The copper develops some surface oxidation and pitting over the 30 or so years the boat will stay in service. I haven't heard of any issues of oxide getting through the epoxy and damaging the seams.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-89725305816811882052018-10-07T01:42:53.123-06:002018-10-07T01:42:53.123-06:00I have been following the project from two years o...I have been following the project from two years or so. And i really believe that is a good project with really good potential when fuel starts to get expensive (And everything becomes expensive the next year)<br /><br /><br />And I know you're an engineer like myself Dimitry, and maybe you think that letting a design speak for itself is a good marketing strategy, but it is not. And what worries me about Quidnon is not the design itself, but the lack of customers interested in that lifestyle, at least not from the start of production of quidnon. When things get worse from an energy standpoint, quidnon will start to shine, but until then, the feelins of the folks at Sailing Anarchy or any other fancy boat forum will be a reflection of the general public. Jordi C. https://www.blogger.com/profile/05629146174761626383noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-71315475531103801052018-10-06T18:12:11.361-06:002018-10-06T18:12:11.361-06:00Seems to me the seams are the weak link. The expos...Seems to me the seams are the weak link. The exposed copper bottom will oxidize and creep under the seam adhesive. Any chance of brazing or soldering the seam?<br /><br />Everyone in my area, and I mean everyone, has a camper/RV. All I hear about from them is how the place they want to go is booked out a year or two and when you get there it is row after row of campers/RVs and invariably their neighbors are noisy A-holes. Also the cost is hundreds of dollars a week end.<br /><br />My electric sternwheel pontoon boat can go anywhere up and down the willamette valley, poking into the many sidings and tributaries, spending the nights in the most magical spots all for free, well except for the $2 or $3 dollars it costs to recharge the battery bank after a long weekend. Almost never see anyone else out there.<br /><br />Cheers!<br /><br />Jef Jefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04054086221209209274noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-47208635547260817782018-10-06T13:04:27.350-06:002018-10-06T13:04:27.350-06:00The copper that's the most economical and will...The copper that's the most economical and will last the lifetime of the boat is 16-gauge roofing copper. The adhesive will be the same epoxy used to laminate the hull. I've looked carefully at System 3 and it seems to be a good fit for the job. The other considerations you bring up don't matter much.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-45217891489735312262018-10-06T12:51:59.944-06:002018-10-06T12:51:59.944-06:00re:
Copper plate
We used C280 'Muntz metal...re:<br />Copper plate<br /><br />We used C280 'Muntz metal' copper alloy plate in decorative sculptures. It anneals beautifully, and weathers consistently. All our sculptures are inland and above sea-level (so far), so we cannot contribute our experience to constant-immersion such as Quidnon might require.<br /><br />Which copper alloys are you testing?<br />Which adhesives?<br /><br />Velocities should not be a concern while the houseboat anchors in rivers and estuaries. However, oxygenation may accelerate stripping of the protective corrosion film.<br /><br />At houseboat speeds == <6-knots ? == oxygenation probably has little-to-no galvanic opportunities due to cavitation caused by velocity. However, directional forces come on play, with parallel slip the least intrusive. Mooring or moving with the water flow suits this project; counter-flow creates additional opportunities for protective film reduction. Winds opposing water flow may impact velocity temporarily; at that point, plate thickness adds durability at the cost of freeboard, maneuverability, and initial construction expense. Adding durability and its costs may deter budget-conscious builders, leading some builders to eliminate essential structure and scantlings. The potential for the inevitable resultant bad-press needs to be addressed during the publicity prior to releasing the finished plans. Agreed?<br /><br />We are interested in Quidnon for its low-cost low-impact manufacturing by untrained hands, primarily owner-builders. The copper alloy type will depend on cost and availability. If the appropriate-alloy-for-use is only available on a different coast or different continent...LargeMargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01530497760743766465noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-67555616219069510412018-10-05T15:39:16.965-06:002018-10-05T15:39:16.965-06:00Very good Dmitry! There's also the issue of al...Very good Dmitry! There's also the issue of all popular anti-fouling paints being a major pollutant in waterways…LloydMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00209133258452909160noreply@blogger.com