tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post3991763079141306048..comments2024-02-27T11:15:46.473-06:00Comments on Quidnon: Electrical systemDmitry Orlovhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-28659794517863336292015-02-24T07:35:45.139-06:002015-02-24T07:35:45.139-06:00I found that T-105s are most effective. I prefer 6...I found that T-105s are most effective. I prefer 6V over 12V because there are fewer cells to a battery, and since a single bad cell invalidates the entire battery, a 6V battery is half as likely to have to be junked at any given point. Also, I prefer more smaller batteries than fewer larger ones, so that if one has to be junked, it's less of a hit. Taller batteries can be a problem because they are more tippy, which can be a problem on a boat.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-10136642703026243292015-02-24T07:26:45.140-06:002015-02-24T07:26:45.140-06:00Absolutely do not use Ni-fe batteries. They were ...Absolutely do not use Ni-fe batteries. They were exensively tested during Phoenix EV races I was part of and have severe thermal problems, among other things.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-17148872125184924352015-02-24T07:24:31.232-06:002015-02-24T07:24:31.232-06:00Regarding Trojan T-105 batteries. Note: I built e...Regarding Trojan T-105 batteries. Note: I built electric vehicles for 8 years and used every battery out there, and hammered them all. Trojans are the best by far. T-105s are definitely most cost effective, but they also make a T-125 if you want more capacity in same package or T-145 in slightly taller package with same footprint. Similar lifespan for all if I remember correctly. More expensive of course.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-86484939945365156642015-02-18T22:37:41.092-06:002015-02-18T22:37:41.092-06:00Dmitry,Thanks for the detailed reply. I am pleased...Dmitry,Thanks for the detailed reply. I am pleased to have this information as I am a big fan of a shallow draft. Perhaps our paths will cross on the East Coast or in the Caribbean/Bahamas Departing Portsmouth NH in July 2015.We will be aboard S/V Madrigal. A ketch rigged ,clipper bow Brewer 42. Old school, heavy displacement, full keel. Fair winds.jk8588https://www.blogger.com/profile/04002852055037354063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-1024570927801019532015-02-18T13:04:01.701-06:002015-02-18T13:04:01.701-06:00Hi JK,
I've sailed a few thousand ocean miles...Hi JK,<br /><br />I've sailed a few thousand ocean miles in a flat-bottomed boat, and the problem of pounding does not exist. Flat-bottomed, ballasted boats are very tender in the middle and incredibly stiff when heeled over, which means that they are always heeling. Even when running dead downwind, the weight of the boom and sails on one side causes it to heel over, presenting a V to the water. And a V-bottomed hull does not pound. There is always some amount of slapping, but no pounding. Pounding episodes tend to be few and far between, and most of the time they are easily corrected by changing course or trim ever so slightly. With sharpie hulls, which have a stem at the bow, pounding can be greatly reduced by putting the bottom of the stem a few inches below the waterline. On a scow hull, which presents a flat, slanted surface at the bow, this approach isn't possible, but probably isn't necessary, since the V, when heeled over, extends all the way forward.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-18913764422429934622015-02-18T11:15:16.922-06:002015-02-18T11:15:16.922-06:00Dmitry, Enjoying the boat project. One question. F...Dmitry, Enjoying the boat project. One question. Forgive me if I missed the answer somewhere. How have you addressed the problem of bottom pounding especially with short wavelength waves. It seems to me this may be the greatest stressor faced by a relatively flat bottomed vessel in an ocean environment. Would love to hear your reasoning/solution. Thanks and best wishes.jk8588https://www.blogger.com/profile/04002852055037354063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-33683143262570022522015-02-04T11:48:51.785-06:002015-02-04T11:48:51.785-06:00And for refrigeration/freezer...check out the ARB ...And for refrigeration/freezer...check out the ARB units...very low power consumption, rugged.<br /><br />http://store.arbusa.com/Fridges-C11.aspxlostinthewoodshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06638690912925773954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-16860017374911870532015-02-04T11:46:33.495-06:002015-02-04T11:46:33.495-06:00I've been using Trojan 8D AGM batteries (12 vo...I've been using Trojan 8D AGM batteries (12 volt)...safe for the pitch and yawl of boats and do not need to be vented.lostinthewoodshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06638690912925773954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-88014460124945211302015-02-02T10:34:55.796-06:002015-02-02T10:34:55.796-06:00One alternative is to increase the control voltage...One alternative is to increase the control voltage at the turbines, say to 16 volts, then add a dump load controller and dump load, usually a water heater element. Many of the solar charge controllers have a dump load setting, such as the Tristar 60 amp controller. The advantages are that any voltage loss in the wiring from turbine to battery is able to be ignored (within reason) and the settings can be adjusted so that excess solar and wind power gives free hot water. It also gives some redundancy in that if the dump load controller fails, you have the option of re-engaging the original controllersDennis Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04525900170454935174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-29703788326082505352015-01-30T16:57:46.237-06:002015-01-30T16:57:46.237-06:00At least you've done your research on battery ...At least you've done your research on battery technologies. Most boaters post to a forum and take the crowd response as gospel.<br /><br />A few reasons why these are not widely (or publicly) used by others:<br />1. Mass. These things are heavy, and a little bulky, for the charge they carry. For lots of boaters who own cruiser/racers, that's a dealbreaker. For you, it's simply called ballast.<br />2. "Newer tech is better!" mentality, in spite of a great deal of contrary evidence.<br />3. "What? I have to buy a single cell at a time and it's only 1.2v per cell? That's crazy!" mentality. Uh, gee. It's pretty easy math, and it means you can replace individual cells if need be. Try that with your fancy schmancy LiFePo!<br />4. Initial cost. Plenty of folks fail to consider long-term maintenance and replacement costs, especially when it comes to batteries. These batteries are pretty spendy at the front and dirt cheap ten years down the road.<br />5. Basic confusion over charge cycles and pretty much everything else to do with batteries.<br /><br />Personally, I'll be installing NiFe batteries in my boat. I'd much rather have a KOH spill in the battery box than sulphuric acid. I'd also rather have H2 and O2 venting from overcharging batteries than H2S. Also, KOH is less costly when it comes time to replace the electrolyte and is more likely available in the third world.Paraplegic Racehorsehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04476785141481772474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-55014386985546492492015-01-29T21:54:55.386-06:002015-01-29T21:54:55.386-06:00Standard blue styrofoam, which you would want anyw...Standard blue styrofoam, which you would want anyways for it's water resistance, can take an incredible compression load. This is the type of insulation under my house, so it is a normal use to pour concrete on it. You may have to do a bunch of cutting to get it to fit the curve of the hull is the only problem (Dave's Triloboats are much easier to fit it to)Dennis Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04525900170454935174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-48016843505157679702015-01-29T20:04:21.784-06:002015-01-29T20:04:21.784-06:00I have. I am not aware of any cruisers or liveaboa...I have. I am not aware of any cruisers or liveaboards out there who have one. And I refuse to be the first.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-18660164410008550392015-01-29T19:06:17.643-06:002015-01-29T19:06:17.643-06:00Dmitry, have you investigated "edison" b...Dmitry, have you investigated "edison" batteries, aka Nickel Iron? There seems many advantages, not least the lifespan and ability to refurbish.<br /><br />http://www.mpoweruk.com/nickel_iron.htm has some basic info.Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04362914354034845508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-69889413896907086682015-01-29T17:32:08.574-06:002015-01-29T17:32:08.574-06:00Hmm... In my case the insulation under the mast st...Hmm... In my case the insulation under the mast step/ballast slab has to take a compressive load... maybe the whole thing is just too much of a complication.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-19659802763805478012015-01-29T17:30:50.777-06:002015-01-29T17:30:50.777-06:00The build is not hard no matter what. The pain poi...The build is not hard no matter what. The pain point with putting a wind generator atop the mast is the amount of fat copper stranded cable it requires. The charge controller is up inside the unit itself, and so if the wires aren't fat the performance suffers a lot.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-19053079078402043932015-01-29T15:27:05.834-06:002015-01-29T15:27:05.834-06:00hey Dmitry I just noticed that they have a mizzen ...hey Dmitry I just noticed that they have a mizzen mast mount bracket that would fit the S400, but as you say you would need a car to have somewhere to put the made in the USA bumper sticker, and you would probably need to sell yourself down at the wharf to pay for it because it has one of those pesky marine grade stamps on it. Looks like it would be an easy peasy build though....hmmmmtheartandzenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15365085223743348032noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-46107230451895824292015-01-29T15:20:59.511-06:002015-01-29T15:20:59.511-06:00I have a question that is the inverse of Kent'...I have a question that is the inverse of Kent's. What are the *truly* minimum necessary powered equipment on a live-aboard boat, and are there alternatives that don't require electricity? The point of this exercise is to reduce the size of the battery system, and maybe the charging system. Obviously, the VHF marine transceiver requires electricity, but that alone wouldn't justify a 6 kilowatt-hour battery bank, 800 watts of solar panels and two air turbines. Probably the anchor light needs to be electric, because while other choices exist, they are not efficient and tend to involve a flame, which you might not want lit while you sleep. What about the bilge pump? Is there an alternative to electric power? If not, how much power does a bilge pump actually draw while running, and how long do you *need* it to be able to run? Would you be able to reduce the runtime you were comfortable with if your boat could send your phone a text message whenever the bilge pump has been running too long, as an alarm of sorts while you're away? This could be done with a small programmable controller such as an arduino. You've already stated that the cabin lighting will either be natural or led, and that is a variable load anyway. How much energy does an anchor light consume in, say, 10 hours? How much power does the VHF radio consume in an idle (non-transmitting) state? If your system could be reduced to 400 watts solar, one air turbine and four 6v batteries, would you be able to run the systems?MoonShadowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07026735575577934205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-53749260909078095732015-01-29T15:05:54.737-06:002015-01-29T15:05:54.737-06:00Off-topic for this post, but just a caveat to my p...Off-topic for this post, but just a caveat to my posts a couple of days back about rocket stoves: Your heat-store concrete will need wrapping comprehensively in insulation, underneath particularly, to stop heat escaping through the keelson to the water. Judging by my boat rocket, this is quite critical. I have and average of five inches of glassfibre underneath my stove, insulating it from the floor plates. You may find that the best tweak is just to have a limited uninsulated surface on the top of the concrete mass only, and everything else hayboxed up completely, two or three inches of glassfibre at least; keeps the heat store hotter longer, and just trickles heat upwards to the cabin sole.Rhisiart Gwilymhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16198537913810396544noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-77877295110519475342015-01-29T14:43:33.043-06:002015-01-29T14:43:33.043-06:00I know some people who run gensets, but the boat h...I know some people who run gensets, but the boat has to be wired for 12V for illumination, pumps, instrumentation and communications anyway, plus a solution that is solid-state (except for the batteries, but they last for years if they aren't cycled) is much better than one with moving parts that burns fuel. Solar panels are required for leaving the boat unattended, so that the batteries stay charged, the bilges stay dry and the anchor light lights up at night. A genset is one of those add-ons for people who are power-hogs.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-41114556946805524492015-01-29T14:02:25.196-06:002015-01-29T14:02:25.196-06:00Dmitry, in keeping with the "nothing marine&q...Dmitry, in keeping with the "nothing marine" philosophy, have you considered using a gas-powered generator instead of the battery bank? Then you just wire the whole boat for 110V. Generators have become very common and inexpensive, and some are very quiet too. You'd need to run it whenever you wanted to use an electrical appliance, but that might not be very often if you cook with propane. Lighting, laptops, etc. can be powered by their own batteries.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17801584509074394317noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-85695828825744903332015-01-29T13:47:41.922-06:002015-01-29T13:47:41.922-06:00That's another way....That's another way....MoonShadowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07026735575577934205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-21225175335010229732015-01-29T13:21:48.825-06:002015-01-29T13:21:48.825-06:00Go on shore and use a laundromat. When sailing, sa...Go on shore and use a laundromat. When sailing, sail naked.Dmitry Orlovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00381674543530177679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-76164169404299270352015-01-29T13:19:35.839-06:002015-01-29T13:19:35.839-06:00Wave action, not tidal rocking. Sorry.Wave action, not tidal rocking. Sorry.MoonShadowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07026735575577934205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-24337082148765139692015-01-29T13:18:34.924-06:002015-01-29T13:18:34.924-06:00The classic thing to do on a boat is to take a 5 g...The classic thing to do on a boat is to take a 5 gallon bucket with a sealable top, put in 2 gallons or so of freshwater & a spoonful or two of detergent, put in a few clothes and secure it to the deck. After a few hours of tidal rocking, dump the soapy water and replace with rinse water. Two hours later hang them on a line till dry.MoonShadowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07026735575577934205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7334230772332433270.post-34420230420542034292015-01-29T13:15:56.406-06:002015-01-29T13:15:56.406-06:00Of course! You'll probably just sail to warm...Of course! You'll probably just sail to warmer climes before it gets very cold, anyway, correct?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com